CHALLENGE TO LARRY BECRAFT

becraft@hiwaay.net

By Bill Thornton, x@1215.org

From: Bill Thornton
Date: April 2, 2001, 10:51 PM PST
To: Larry Becraft

Larry Becraft wrote:

> Hey Bill,
>
> Now that you have provided more detail about the meeting you
> mentioned, I have a better idea about what you had in mind.
> Let me tell you what I recall.
>
> [complete quote is at bottom]

To: Larry Becraft:

OK....now that you know that I'm not coming out of left field about the meeting, now that you recall there really was such a meeting, let's move on.

At that meeting (actually a 3-day seminar) I was the last speaker. I presented some concepts to you. My presentation was mostly verbal. Your response was basically this: Bill Thornton is wrong. Period. Purely your opinion. No substance. No rationality. You just flat labeled me as being totally wrong. When I tried to get you to provide some rational support for your opinion, you angrily reiterated your opinion in a much louder voice. In short, you blew your cool. Then you abandoned the 3rd day of the meeting. The few people with whom I still have contact from that meeting remember it well.

About a dozen years have now passed. You've had time to mature, get some of the fire out of your blood, and develop your own understanding of our legal systems. I've documented my concepts. (I've also successfully applied them.) You now have the web site to peruse that documentation at your leisure.

During the past dozen or so years you have presented yourself as a person "...at war with these lies promoted by the liaryers." Here is an excerpt from your most recent declaration:

> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Larry Becraft
> Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2001 7:26 AM
> > ...There is a big problem with this freedom movement
> > which has its origins in "bad information." There are lots
> > of emotional legal arguments which people believe that
> > are absurd and groundless.... There are gurus who
> > throw in everyone's face lots of lies which mislead
> > people. I am at war with these lies promoted
> > by the liaryers.
> >
> > Larry Becraft

If you are in fact a promoter of truth, and "at war with these lies promoted by the liaryers," here is a sure fire opportunity to put up or shut up. More than a few are interested in this conversation we are having. And, I am going to put the whole exchange up on my website--unedited.

Over the last decade or so you've blown a lot of smoke about my legal concepts. You've done the same regarding others who have likewise, on their own, rediscovered those concepts. But, the best you have ever done is to express your opinion without ever providing good solid black letter law, case law, or even any theory.

Larry Becraft, the buck stops here.

You can either slink away into the darkness of ignorance, or you can show your intellectual mettle and benefit everyone in patriot movement by your experience, wisdom and knowledge.

A decade ago I and others went way out of our way to do you and Bill Benson a favor which you both accepted. Your air travel, motel, and car rental expenses were fully paid for. Once you accepted the invitation to the seminar, your only obligation was to extend the courtesy of listening to the legal concepts we had to offer, then decide for yourself whether or not they applied to the case at hand, namely Bill Benson's case.

Instead, what you did was trash everyone's information, cut short the seminar, then use the remainder of the scheduled time to tend to unrelated business at the expense of your benefactor. We all watched you slink away into the darkness. My opinion at the time was that you were the victim of your own youthful indiscretion. (In some parts of the world it is considered cool to be discourteous.)

Of course, discourtesy has nothing directly to do with intelligence. You are obviously a very intelligent man. That's one characteristic that I admire about you. You are also well schooled in law. If I thought otherwise, I would not waste one second of my time on this. Now let's put your reputation where your mouth is.

THE CHALLENGE

You say you are "at war with these lies promoted by the liaryers." Do you mean what you say?

I've documented the challenge to you: http://www.1215.org . If you are not up to taking on the whole thing, then feel free to limit your analysis to these core web pages to which the remainder of that web site is tied:

You've trashed what I've had to say before. At that time it was private and verbal. Now it's in writing, and public. This is your chance to trash it again, or bless it.. Either way, the patriot movement will benefit, but only if you do it with thoughtfulness, rationality, and clear, substantive legal argument. If you again merely opine (without rational argument) that I am wrong, or if you simply remain silent, I am certain that the public at large will know how to interpret that.

Monkey's on your back.

Bill Thornton x@1215.org


Larry Becraft wrote:

> Hey Bill,
>
> Now that you have provided more detail about the meeting you > mentioned, I have a better idea about what you had in mind. > Let me tell you what I recall. > > I remember talking with Dr. Brock and it was sometime around > 1988 or even the year before. Bill had some serious seizure > problems in 1987 and early 1988, and that caused his trial to > be postponed until the fall of 1989. That trip tp LA was long > before Bill's trial. > > I talked with Brock at length and remember some of the things > he told me. He stated that during the Viet Nam war, a lot of > blacks claimed to be captured aliens and this caused the > govt some problems. In talking with Brock, I knew that I at > least wanted to chat with him further. > > I don't remember any specifics about the trip you mention and > have a vague memory. It seems that whoever wanted Bill to go > to LA wanted him to hear some legal theories. Bill made > arrangements for us to go there and I was out of that loop > regarding those arrangements. We went, flying into Orange > County I believe, and I remember a meeting at somebody's house > one morning. We told people that we could not stay the entire > time because there were others we had to also meet on that trip > (Leo Masters). I remember riding around with one of the patriots > at that meeting and I think we went to go get some materials he > had at an office. During that little trip, I learned that the > driver was deep into Roger Elvick theories, which do not > interest me. > > We left the meeting at the house to go meet other people. We > went to LA to hear some legal theories of others and we did > listen. We discharged that obligation. > > I hope this helps explain at least what I recall happened. > Wish you success. > > larry

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